The great processor and chipset discussion thread

[zbuu]

dude i am a gamer. the only thing that matters in gaming is the gpu.
i can definitely afford an i7 setup . but i rather invest it on a good gpu .

You haven't answered my first question (which was expected). I want that answered.
And if GPU is the only thing that matters to you then it so contradicts your "i love intel" rants.
GPU is not the only thing that matters in playing games. A good gamer is aware of that. It takes a well balanced rig to perform well in games & various benchmarks.
Like I said before in the other thread,
A PC is as good as its user. If you are completely clueless about them, its no surprise for you to depend on the most obvious brand in the market & say "yeah im the best, im a gamer, i love intel, im a fan of intel" etc. etc.

Whats your current setup?

@omprakash
Like I said earlier to you, your so-called point is not alien to me. The way you put it, is wrong & always will be.
You don't have to be an expert nobel prize winner to know that i7 is currently the highest performing desktop processor on earth. Everybody knows this. What matters when it comes to building PCs is the budget.
Your use of the word "BEST" means different to different people. Something which I have already tried telling you before.

dude e8400 is one of the best c2d pros for gaming also it ovecloks well. i ha decided to buy this pro based on many reviews on the net and also i hav read many customer reviews on the net (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6819115037) .

and abt ur 1st question

1)personally i dont care
2) y shld i answr that quetion when guys like u are out thr -- ur r the VFM expert rite?? :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

-- Sat Aug 01, 2009 9:26 am --

dude i am a gamer. the only thing that matters in gaming is the gpu.
i can definitely afford an i7 setup . but i rather invest it on a good gpu .

You haven't answered my first question (which was expected). I want that answered.
And if GPU is the only thing that matters to you then it so contradicts your "i love intel" rants.
GPU is not the only thing that matters in playing games. A good gamer is aware of that. It takes a well balanced rig to perform well in games & various benchmarks.
Like I said before in the other thread,
A PC is as good as its user. If you are completely clueless about them, its no surprise for you to depend on the most obvious brand in the market & say "yeah im the best, im a gamer, i love intel, im a fan of intel" etc. etc.

Whats your current setup?

@omprakash
Like I said earlier to you, your so-called point is not alien to me. The way you put it, is wrong & always will be.
You don't have to be an expert nobel prize winner to know that i7 is currently the highest performing desktop processor on earth. Everybody knows this. What matters when it comes to building PCs is the budget.
Your use of the word "BEST" means different to different people. Something which I have already tried telling you before.

dude e8400 is one of the best c2d pros for gaming also it ovecloks well( it even beats some intels quad cpus) . i ha decided to buy this pro based on many reviews on the net and also i hav read many customer reviews on the net (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6819115037) .

and abt ur 1st question

1)personally i dont care
2) y shld i answr that quetion when guys like u are out thr -- ur r the VFM expert rite?? :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

[erif]

dude e8400 is one of the best c2d pros for gaming also it ovecloks well.

well its old.

for 7.5K, you can get 720be which has 3 cores, unlocked multiplier, runs cool, can be unlocked into a quad core, overclocks really well.
Not to mention cheaper motherboard.

[imported_zoombas]

dude e8400 is one of the best c2d pros for gaming also it ovecloks well. i ha decided to buy this pro based on many reviews on the net and also i hav read many customer reviews on the net (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6819115037) .

and abt ur 1st question
1)personally i dont care
2) y shld i answr that quetion when guys like u are out thr -- ur r the VFM expert rite?? :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Nah you chose E8400 because it's from INTEL. That's fine. But saying it's the best for gaming makes you quite unintelligent.
E8400 - 2 cores - LGA775 - Old - No upgrade path - End of life - Costs 8k+ - Totally bad choice currently.

PHenom II x3 720 - 3 cores - AM3 - New - Backward compatible with AM2+ mobos, - Good upgrade path - 7.5k+ - Totally good VFM - Performs well than E8400 - Overclocks well.
The extra core in the 720 can provide a clear advantage in well threaded workloads, not to mention that it's got 1.5MB of L2 cache and 6MB of L3 cache at its disposal.
Oh & of course, it's a potential quad-core if you have the right batch & recommended mobo. All this for just 7.5k as opposed to your obsolete E8400 which costs more.

Personally, I don't give a rat's ass what you answer/feel/think. But when you're coming in this thread & not doing proper discussions, I'm compelled to remind you once again - Do not rant/whine/troll or I will report you to the mods.

P.S: 3rd time I'm asking you - What's your current setup?

[dvijaydev46]

dude e8400 is one of the best c2d pros for gaming also it ovecloks well. i ha decided to buy this pro based on many reviews on the net and also i hav read many customer reviews on the net (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6819115037) .

For AMD this means this is the fastest dual-core processor to date, and for that 102 USD it is just a really okay processor running all the latest applications and games just fine and dandy. Realistically the difference in-between the X2 250 and X2 550 performance wise is roughly 10%. The one thing that this article showed was that for gamers, the Phenom II X2 processor definitely is the way to go.

More interesting I find to be the fact that the Phenom II X2 550 BE is coming awfully close in performance to the 165 USD Core 2 Duo E8400 processor from Intel.

Source
I hope that should explain why I said you were giving bad/false ideas suggesting a CPU when there is a better alternative. Dude get to know that 550BE comes almost close to the better-than-7400 - e8400 especially in games.

I think you haven't bothered to see my reply in the other thread. I repeat: PII 550 BE is almost equal to E8400 which is more expensive than 550BE.

Your above statements show that neither you have knowledge of Chess nor physics. First of all Mathematics is not a subject. That is why Nobel Prize is not given in Maths.

Man I just came to know that you are an ignorant Physics professor.I'm too a physics graduate and a lot of my friends are physics professors. That said, let me tell you this... don't say Maths is not a subject and because of that only there is no nobel prize for that. The reason is different.

Second thing. Logic and Maths are both different subjects.Logic, from the Greek (logiké) is defined to be "The formal systematic study of the principles of valid inference and correct reasoning".

Man don't always quote greek philosophy for logic. Do you think everything the Greeks said is correct? I would tell you physics isn't a subject if mathematics isn't one if your "theory" is right. If there is no logic, then there is no mathematics and even physics. Maths is the base of everything. If e=mc squared then isn't it a math?

[XmarX]

as long as money isnt a constrain , i dont c a reason y people shouldnt buy Intel

Sure, but for almost all people, money is a constraint!

Its more important for servers as most server carry upto 8 processors/ motherboard!
There are multi-motherboard and multi system servers called Blade servers!

So for a server, if i7==3x quad core opterons in price, you can guess which platform would be chosen!!

Or even if budget is not a constraint, for the same price, you get around 3~4 times the server blades!
That would be fantastic!
You can get a much more robust cooling solutions to tackle the increased heat o/p as budget is infinite! :P

[erif]

Man don't always quote greek philosophy for logic. Do you think everything the Greeks said is correct?

Well to be fair, it was the Greeks who were the first ones to start the search for knowledge through logic & reasoning.''

But omie gets some facts wrong when says he that logic dates back to Aristotle (probably an error in his text book :D )
Even Socrates - who came some while before Aristotle - made extensive use of logic.

Thats why before it was called PHILOSOPHY.

Again incorrect. Philosophers dealt a lot with human problems. It includes 'ideals' - which can be quite illogical sometimes.

[imported_omprakash]

Man don't always quote greek philosophy for logic.

The word Logic has come from Greek thats what i wrote and not the definition.

Do you think everything the Greeks said is correct?

No. But what the correct things they said are still correct. Exm- Archimedes Principle.

I would tell you physics isn't a subject if mathematics isn't one if your "theory" is right. If there is no logic, then there is no mathematics and even physics. Maths is the base of everything. If e=mc squared then isn't it a math?

I bet your schooling was poor. I am telling again. Logic is a Process that is applied in all fields including daily life situations.
Again to clear your doubts E=mc squared is not MATH. Do you studied it in MATH?. No you studied it in PHYSICS. Why?......The PHYSICAL INTREPRETATION MAKES it physics.As it says Mass is inter convertible with Energy .That is why i said Math is the LANGUAGE OF SCIENCE. An equation is meaningless when there is no interpretation.

Man I just came to know that you are an ignorant Physics professor.I'm too a physics graduate and a lot of my friends are physics professors. That said, let me tell you this... don't say Maths is not a subject and because of that only there is no nobel prize for that. The reason is different.

Ignorant?. For your kind information that i wrote was not my feelings it was of Richard Feynmann's which i support. And you and your Friends are no match to him.What he said is something a logical thing. Science will not exist w/o maths. So it universal. Its LANGUAGE OF SCIENCE.It has no (direct) contribution to mankind. But without it (indirectly)Mankind wouldn't have adavanced.
Now its evident how u have completed your Graduation if u say E=mc squared is maths.
Erif wrote

Well to be fair, it was the Greeks who were the first ones to start the search for knowledge through logic & reasoning.''

nicely said.

But omie gets some facts wrong when says he that logic dates back to Aristotle (probably an error in his text book )
Even Socrates - who came some while before Aristotle - made extensive use of logic.

Its eroor in your book and you can check it my friend.
The point is Aristotle is remembered as he showed the world the use of logic.He is the first one who wrote on Logic and the definition of it in 6 texta known as organon.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Term_logic
Also erif Aristotle is more important than socrates in Greek history.
Aristotle (Greek: ???????????, Aristotél?s) (384 BC – 322 BC) was a Greek philosopher, a student of Plato and teacher of Alexander the Great. He wrote on many subjects, including physics, metaphysics, poetry, theater, music, logic, rhetoric, politics, government, ethics, biology, and zoology. He is generally regarded as one of the greatest Philosophers of all time and one of the most influential men in human history[1].
Together with Plato and Socrates (Plato's teacher), Aristotle is one of the most important founding figures in Western philosophy. He was the first to create a comprehensive system of Western philosophy, encompassing morality and aesthetics, logic and science, politics and metaphysics. Aristotle's views on the physical sciences profoundly shaped medieval scholarship, and their influence extended well into the Renaissance, although they were ultimately replaced by Newtonian Physics. In the biological sciences, some of his observations were confirmed to be accurate only in the nineteenth century. His works contain the earliest known formal study of logic, which was incorporated in the late nineteenth century into modern formal logic. In metaphysics, Aristotelianism had a profound influence on philosophical and theological thinking in the Islamic and Jewish traditions in the Middle Ages, and it continues to influence Christian theology, especially Eastern Orthodox theology, and the scholastic tradition of the Catholic Church. All aspects of Aristotle's philosophy continue to be the object of active academic study today.

-- Sat Aug 01, 2009 7:35 pm --

Aristotle was FIRST to write on LOGIC and Socrates. From wiki....
Aristotle "says that 'on the subject of reasoning' he 'had nothing else on an earlier date to speak of'". However, Plato reports that syntax was devised before him, by Prodicus of Ceos, who was concerned by the correct use of words. Logic seems to have emerged from dialectics; the earlier philosophers made frequent use of concepts like reductio ad absurdum in their discussions, but never truly understood the logical implications. Even Plato had difficulties with logic; although he had a reasonable conception of a deduction system, he could never actually construct one and relied instead on his dialectic. Plato believed that deduction would simply follow from premises, hence he focused on maintaining solid premises so that the conclusion would logically follow. Consequently, Plato realized that a method for obtaining conclusions would be most beneficial. He never succeeded in devising such a method, but his best attempt was published in his book Sophist, where he introduced his division method.
For your reference.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aristotle
Erif, with kind consideration, i never write anything that i have no proof of..If i had please let me know. No one is perfect in this world.So please think when you post against my views. You are always welcome.
Regards
Om Prakash
-- Sat Aug 01, 2009 7:42 pm --

Zoombas wrote

PHenom II x3 720 - 3 cores - AM3 - New - Backward compatible with AM2+ mobos, - Good upgrade path - 7.5k+ - Totally good VFM - Performs well than E8400 - Overclocks well.

Also with correct motherboard you can activate the the FOURTH core in AMD X3 ,as its a 4 cores chip with a bad 1 core. makes it 3 cores. And the advantage is that you will get a quad at the price of dual. Great Choice will be this. 3 core chips from AMD are basically 4 core with a bad core. Better to sell cheap than chuck.

[erif]

Erif the definition is in wiki also you can refer. My be error in WIKI's Text book. The point is Aristotle is remembered as he showed the world the use of logic.

Yeah well, the info in wiki is always complied from other sources.

“…we’re (Socrates and Polemarchus) incapable of finding it (the meaning of justice)” (Cahn 2002, 119). This is only one of many cases where Socrates cannot find an answer in his deep, deep investigation of the meaning of one concept. He constantly changes the subject in trying to figure out the concept, or he constantly leaves one problem in the solution behind for a later time and never actually returns to it creating many problems ion the solution. It almost seems as if Socrates is finding ways not to answer the question he is inquiring. Why would he do this? Does he mean to do this? I would not think so, but it seems he does this to get every angle on the question he is trying to answer and different angles mean conflicting views or ideas, creating debate on the angle of one man. Either way he fails to accomplish his task he set out to complete.

I think Socrates and his method of Dialogue and dialectic are often mis-understood. People often criticize of it going around in circles.

But he never "claimed" to have any answers himself. Plato says his dialogues started when Socrates' friend went to the Oracle of Delphi and asked who the wisest person was. THe reply was that there was none wiser than Socrates.

But Socrates said that the Oracle must have erred, since he himself admitted he was ignorant. He then went out on a quest to disprove the oracle by going to the prominent people of Athens (Judges, teachers, Sophists) and engaging them in a dialogue on various concepts such as morals, ethics, beauty, justice, virtue.

But he never himself gave a definition of any of them. He asked other people who "claimed" to be masters of a particular topic. He then dissected their views & beliefs and pointed out their flaws using reason & logic. This way he proved that the people, who considered themselves to be very knowledgeable, actually knew very little.

Thus, it turned out that the oracle was true - Socrates was the wisest because he knew about his own ignorance of matters. While most other people thought that they had all the answers, they only lived in world of illusions where they were unaware of their ignorance.


A simplified example of a Socratic Dialogue is-

(Socrates questioning a prominent judge)

Socrates: Could you spare me a moment? I wanted to ask you something.

Judge: Ofcourse socrates, what is it?

Socrates: Can you please define justice for me?

Judge: Ofcourse Socrates its very simple. Justice is giving back to a person, what you rightfully owe him. For example, if you borrow somebody's knife, then you have to rightfully return it to him. It would be wrong to keep it with you forever.

Socrates: But, imagine if you borrowed my knife. And tomorrow if something so bad happens between us, that I want to kill you for it, but I don't have any means to. So, will it be JUSTICE to give me back my knife? Even if I was going to kill you with it?

Judge: Umm umm........ no Socrates, that would not be justice....

Socrates: Then what is justice? I really want to know.


The dialogue would go this way. The judge can give 10 different definitions, and Socrates would point out a logical or rational flaw every time.

In the end, the dialogue would end like;

Judge: Ok ok, I admit I don't know what justice is. Why don't you tell me Socrates?

Socrates: But I never claimed that I knew what justice was. It is you who sit in your respectable position claiming to know what justice is, and passing judgments on other people.

Then the other guy would just run away.
Socrates was a master in his craft - his method was dialectic, but often the other person would get angry and frustrated and ofter resort to rhetoric. Even in rhetoric, he could beat the most talented Sophists. But that often meant a complete breakdown of discussion.


He did give one important solution of his own. When ath

Athens was the "Hegemon" in Ancient Greece. They were the ones to introduce democracy first, and like America today, believed that they had a right to rule over all the Greek city states using their democracy.

However, during the Peloponnesian War, Sparta gave Athens a royal beating. This sent Athens into a state of shock, and a period of decay. Athenians thought they were more cultured(with a much more advanced system of government), and never quite understood why they lost to the Spartans.

Socrates gave a simple answer to this-
He said that the Spartans are warriors, who dream of victory through battle. They fight for glory and honor.
Their entire society is so bent towards perfection in combat, that ever since they are born, Spartan children are given intense training in combat and detached from luxury.
He said that Athenians dream of establishing order, government & spreading their culture throughout Greece. But how do they try to achieve it? Have a system of democracy where only the rich get to vote for the rich. Where corrupt people living a life of luxury are the ones who control society. Where only the sons of influential people get to positions of power.
He said that if Athens wanted to excel like Sparta, then they too must train their children since an early age in the art of goverment. They must teach their children to have free thinking and always question the existing practices in society.


Needless to say, the rich & wealthy Athenians saw him a threat to their power and sentenced him to consume poison for corrupting the youth.
However, Socrates' pupils (most prominent being Plato) committed his dialogues into writing and developed further philosophy from it. Plato even founded the first college of logical/rational thought. The college boasted of members such as Aristotle himself.

[dvijaydev46]

I bet your schooling was poor.

Again to clear your doubts E=mc squared is not MATH. Do you studied it in MATH?. No you studied it in PHYSICS. Why?......The PHYSICAL INTREPRETATION MAKES it physics.As it says Mass is inter convertible with Energy .That is why i said Math is the LANGUAGE OF SCIENCE. An equation is meaningless when there is no interpretation.

LOL I don't want to the topic deviate from CPU to logic, math and physics. So let me stop here and let's talk something useful.

[zartan047]

Yup people, we are deviating from the main stuff here...Enough about other subjects and Greek people.